I appreciate you sharing the roadmap, love your products…they are throughout my entire home. I’m glad to see you are focusing on lighting and switches. I’m in the process of remodeling my basement and looking to leverage low voltage/PoE lighting for various reasons. There aren’t many players in that market (yet) especially for residential, is this something the team at inovelli has explored?
What’s the difference between the 5 button switch and 5 button remote?
Switch is hardwired and controls 1 light directly. Remote is battery operated and can be pulled out of the wall to be mobile. Think Lutron Pico.
What I’m seeing (and not so thrilled about) is that all 70+ of my currently z-wave devices will end up needing to be swapped out at $50/each for WiFi devices. While Matter talks about using Zigbee, it sounds like they expect essentially all powered devices to use WiFi.
And. That means running into limitations/frustration with router capabilities (I already have like 100 things on mine and I have a small, 3BR house). Once people start automating more than a small handful of things, they’ll start running into the “255” limit on router subnets. Plus, I already have SO many competing wifi signals in my house (oddly, it seems like MY routers never show up as being that much stronger than 5+ from around my neighborhood). I am very concerned about how things will work with my cameras and other devices that pump a lot of data across my wifi when I add 100 more things to my wifi network.
And, in any case, both will be using the 2.4GHz band–which you already see people complaining about, due to congestion.
Given that we’re talking Google/Amazon/Apple, I’m also less than thrilled pondering what they are intending on doing with the “internet compatibility”. I can see them requiring that their stuff talk across the internet, etc. so they can get more marketing information from them (at least Google/Amazon).
It’s going to be interesting to see how this all shakes out., As I’ve said before, I’m deeply concerned about “smart home automation” being dumbed WAY down from the capabilities of hubs like HA and HE and becoming minimally useful things like Google Home/Alexa (because Google/Amazon have the “eye and ears” of everyone plus massive marketing prowess, most people won’t know anything else exists).
I do wonder what that means for Z-Wave in the future. The 700 LR stuff isn’t really started yet (that has some super interesting possibilities)–but if that’s totally not supported by “Matter” and you have Google, Amazon, Phillips/Signify, GE, Jasco, Yale, etc. all on board with Matter, it doesn’t leave much of anybody out there doing Z-Wave in the future.
And, as for Zigbee devices being updated to use “Matter”…it seems that may simply be reprogramming them to speak 2.4GHz Wi-Fi instead of Zigbee???
I guess that also means replacing 100 Wi-Fi devices so they all use the 5GHz (or newer Wi-Fi 6) frequencies to avoid congestion (although the 5GHz range is VERY limited range, so also means buying more routers).
All in all…I can see a lot of money leaving my bank account if I want to keep up.
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We are not planning to leave the z-wave market, I promise! Z-Wave will still be a major player for the big alarm companies, etc so I don’t personally think it’s going anywhere anytime soon. We have always really wanted to land those large B2B companies as clients and are now starting to do just that and they all want z-wave. Our plan is that any product we make in Zigbee/Matter we will also be making in Z-wave. It may take a bit longer due to our manufacturer not being very cooperative, but hopefully that will be changing as soon as we have an investor come on.
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Where did you hear that? 
My understanding is it will work with either one (and also Bluetooth for configuration). I didn’t see any ‘expectation’ that all powered devices use WiFi. I did read where it said WiFi devices are expected to be non-battery-powered but that is not the same as saying all line-powered devices must be WiFi. Similarly, I believe there is an expectation that battery-powered devices will be Zigbee. But line-powered devices could be Zigbee as well.
255 is the default subnet size but is not a hjard limit, and its easily changeable. But your basic point is something to consider. Different brands/models will have different upper limits on the total number of WiFi clients they can support at one time.
THEIR devices will most certainly want to ‘phone home’ but that doesn’t mean other vendor’s Matter-compatible devices will be required to use the cloud. I don’t see any reason to believe the Inovelli’s Matter products will need to require internet access
They use the same RF band, but that doesn’t mean its just simple ‘reprogramming’ to speak WiFi instead of Zigbee. There are differences in the radio hardare. 2.4Ghz is just a frequency range within the RF spectrum that these different (and incompatible) radios share. Bluetooth also uses the 2.4Ghz band and you can’t ‘reprogram’ a Bluetooth radio to ‘speak WiFi’ either.
When zigbee devices are updated to use Matter, it means they will speak in a different language but using the same radio hardware. That can be done via re-programming without changing any hardware.
Not necessarily all 100 WiFi devices. Any modern device that supports dual-band should be configured to use the 5GHz band when possible … especially if they are streaming video. But other than streaming video, SmartHome devices tend to be very low bandwidth (data rates in Kilo-bits, not Mega-bits or Giga-bits) so 2.4GHz is still a LOT of bandwidth.
Hasn’t that always been true? 
I see nothing different here 
The comment about “low power devices” using one thing and others using WiFi.
Kinda makes it sound like they are pushing for total WiFi (which, of course, gives Amazon and Google even more direct access into our houses. smh
Woot!! Love the A19 bulbs coming in the future! <3
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This roadmap is VERY EXCITING! It gave me an idea I would love to see…a “Dual Switch Remote”. In lieu of that, I can make the paddle remote work (Jack & Jill bathroom with light & fan switches by only one door).
Also excited about the 5-button switch and motion switch.
If the Z-Wave Fan/Light switch is unable to be fixed by the time the Zigbee version comes out, I wonder if Inovelli could provide a trade-in deal?
You could also post in the new classifieds.
@Eric_Inovelli with matter SDK release being pushed out to 2022. Does this help or hurt the roadmap.
https://zigbeealliance.org/news_and_articles/building-a-standard-that-really-matters/
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@Eric_Inovelli I know that there’s issues a) getting 700 series chips, and b) having the ability (namely financially) to produce an updated dimmer/switch.
I’m just curious if there’s any chance of even seeing updated Zwave switches/dimmers in 2022? I’m hoping to update a bunch of my older GE dimmer/switches, but with 700 starting be more prevalent I’m hesitant to invest in a pile of 500-series Inovelli dimmers. My home automation gear is not something I update often as it’s a big expense and a lot of work. I do love the Inovelli dimmers and feel like the “next version” has a chance of really putting them over the top (i.e. having more room to tweak firmware/features, and 700 also seems to allow for shallower hardware).
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Reading about the Zigbee dimmer & On/Off switch, I’m kinda looking at how soon I can replace my on/off switch so I get the full-sized LED bar (I use it more for status than anything)!!!
With my Hubitat, I’m mostly z-wave and have been favoring that, but the “Matter” issue matters. I suspect the world is going to march to the tune of Google/Amazon–despite those being very limited platforms for real “smart” home automation.
I’m kinda stuck about which way to go moving forward.
The Z-Wave LR stuff on the 700 chips has a lot going for it–just not Amazon and Google.
There’s a possibility, yes.
I think it’s something we all need to weigh the pros/cons of (company and consumers). I know we (including Inovelli) all love 700 Series because it’s the new, sexy chipset, but if we, “take a step back” (my favorite corporate saying), what does the 700 Series really provide that the 500 Series can’t?
The pros would be:
- More room for firmware enhancements (big benefit!)
- Faster processing times (but can you really see the difference – I’m not sure)
- Long Range (great for farming, reaching garages, etc – but again, is it something that a 500 series mesh not handle?)
- This would open up additional marketshare for us, which is also great
- Our competition has it
I can’t really think of any other real benefits outside of the above.
The cons would be:
- Expensive from an R&D standpoint – likely $75k per SKU
- We have a proven switch that has been in market for 2.5yrs and has 99.9% of the kinks worked out of it (we believe it’s perfect, but of course there’s always room for improvement lol)
- Lead times are much longer as there’s more demand for it and little supply
NET: If the money is there and it makes sense to upgrade, we likely will as the rest of our switches will be 700 Series, but as of right now, given the points you made (#1 and #2), it’s not looking like we will.
I don’t mean to be a Debbie Downer I promise lol – the other good news is that we’re creating the 2-1 ZigBee switch and plan to use that technology to create the 700 Series switches. I just don’t know if it will happen next year.
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The Z-Wave LR stuff enables “direct to hub” communications over longer distances.
This >should< (hopefully) allow MUCH better/more reliable communications with the hub. It seems there are often “range” issues with current z-wave, as it can struggle to reach the “far ends” of even a normal house. For people with tons of repeating devices, that’s not as much of an issue–but it’s certainly an issue for people with limited numbers of devices.
It also eliminates some seeming complications due to the need to manage hops thru repeaters.
Also missed in the pros: smaller switches (aka less depth). That seems to be the ones that are highlighted by competitors, and I think it’s a really, really big plus. Zwave switches/dimmers are notoriously difficult to fit in older boxes.
I definitely agree that the range and speed aren’t likely to benefit most setups (mine included). One area the range can help though is having less hops to the controller.
I will say, seeing Zooz continuously updating their entire suite of products has me a bit jealous. I would consider them your biggest competitor/compliment (i.e. they are similar in that they’re bringing out a lot of well-featured Zwave stuff at reasonable prices).
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I’ve definitely weighed on whether I should hold off and just start switching to Matter devices. 95% of what I do is through HomeKit (Siri), and that means I’m running everything through Homebridge. But it seems like Zwave is here to stay, and I do think it’s got a lot of good innovation happening, plus who knows how long it will be until Matter is in a “useful” state (and who knows how well everyone will actually end up playing nicely)
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For me 700 series is real nice, however there some new features like zwave lr and z/ip that I think are game changes for zwave.
Zwave lr is longer range and more devices on the network
Z/ip is to reach the device via IP address, should be much faster control and response. Also I think this will play real nice with matter.
If these features are going in to the pot for next gen switch I am willing to wait.
Seems like you should be able to just buy two fan/light combo switches, and only install one canopy module. Then use z-wave associations between the two switches. I’ve never tried this, so I don’t know how well it would work as far as latency, or syncing state between the two switches. You could also probably do it with a regular smart switch as the second switch in “smart bulb” mode with the first switch as the target. Maybe it would be OK for your use case to control the light from both switches but only have one of them control the fan?
The fan/light combo switch requires a hot and a neutral at the switch, but it doesn’t require a load wire. So if you can find the other end of the 2-wire cable that goes into the switch box that doesn’t have a neutral, you can probably rewire it to have hot and neutral, instead of hot and load. No opening of walls needed.
@Eric_Inovelli
So glad to see my requests coming to light. Can’t wait for them to come out (2 in 1, Dual switch, fan switch, Aux) Once these come out I already know I will be replacing many of my existing inovelli switches.(that I just got aka 30 switches LOL) Cant wait for them all to look uniform with the long led on the side and have true AUX switches and say goodbye to my dumb switches. (Going to make me and wife happy) And seeing that MATTER has been officially announced as the standard this is awesome you already planned on moving over to it.
Question about the new switches coming out like the 2in1 & AUX. are they going to be made so no neutral is required? As i have several in my place where there is no neutral that I am currently using the dimmers as on/off for that very reason. (Both required the Aeotec bypass)
Thanks some much for the great products. been loving them for the last few years and having fun installing all new switches into our home that we moved into recently. Fun starting over. And will do many of them again once I can make them all uniform. 
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