Thank you, @kreene1987 ! This is a straight-forward explanation and I think I understand now. Forgive the long post, but I’d like to recap in my own words so that I and anyone else looking for info can find it.
With a dumb dimmer switch, I can walk into my kitchen at midnight, move my dimmer slider all the way down, and then toggle my lights on at that low level so that I am not blinded. I think of this basic lighting concept as “pre-staging” the dimmer. In smart bulbs, there is a discrete “pre-stage” setting that can be referenced in basic rule engines that allows you to pre-stage the brightness level through software automations so that when you activate the bulb by the (button)switch at midnight, you are similarly not blinded by bright light. Unfortunately, this basic function is not available in many competing load-controlling smart switch brands (such as mine).
Now, for what I’m sure are very practical reasons due to the fundamental difference between a switch and a bulb, this same “pre-staging” function found in a dumb dimmer or smart bulb is known as “local default” in an Inovelli switch. Most importantly, “local default” has an identical software implementation to “pre-staging,” so that it is a discrete setting that is easily controlled through basic rule-engine automations.
While it might be more consumer-friendly to simply refer to this setting as “pre-staging,” either way I am glad to learn that it has been included in previous switches and I’d buy some Project Phoenix switches if it is confirmed to be included moving forward.
Yes, and even more advanced than that you can set different levels for if it is commanded remotely (via z-wave) or locally (physical press)!
You have to try it, it’s pretty badass having your entire home at 1% overnight and going to get water everything defaults to very low brightness. GAME CHANGING!
Wonder who coined the term pre-staging. When you stage something you set it up ahead of time. So is pre-staging setting it up ahead of time before you set it up ahead of time?
Yes. It’s in the Inovelli firmware now. But like @kreene1987 said, it goes by a different name. On the Inovelli it’s “Default Level” instead of “Preset Level”
Honestly “Default Level” is a more intuitive term anyway, IMO. Before this thread I’ve never heard of pre-staging as a term used for that functionality and without the explanation, I probably wouldn’t know what that did.
Looking here often to find out when theses 2-1 will be available for preorder.
I’m in Canada and hopefully i’ll be able to get my hands on a 10 pack pretty soon (mean early 2023).
I don’t know if i’ll have to wait for AARTECH to be supplied or just order here from Inovelli.
My psy told me to calm down.
Having my whole house done with Red Dimmers, a few Blacks and Fan+Lights I find this exciting, but some clueless questions: Why are these switches and the Blues called 2-1? Is it just a new name? The current Red dimmers have the main paddle and the config/favorites button, so I’m not sure what the name means.
Other question is what is different in this from the Reds except, of course, having an 800 chip? Are they smaller in width and depth? (I live in a condo that requires metal boxes so putting them in a 2 gang box was a real struggle). Speaking of which, I never had heard about Z-Wave having problems going through metal. Will the 800s be better at that?
The 2-1 refers to being able to work as an on/off switch or a dimmer switch.
I’d be interested to know how it is achieved though. Does it have both a physical relay and a synchronized dimmer and a way to bypass the dimmer, or does the dimmer system have a way to jump instantly to avoid in-between voltages?
Thanks. That seems a little strange to me since, of course, every dimmer switch can be turned on or off. But, from the way you phrased it, I think you’re saying it can be used as just an on/off switch and disable the dimmer function. But like I’m betting virtually everyone does, I do just turn my dimmer on or off most of the time, so I’m not sure why someone would want to do that. But, I guess there are use cases that I’m just not thinking about and this takes the place of the Black series (though those were cheaper than the Red series) so if this helps them reach a bigger market without having to make 2 series (like the Red vs Black) then good for them. However, by making the ramp and dim rates zero and disabling the multi-tap delay I can make the Red series a virtual instant on/off now, so I still don’t get the name, unless they think it is good for marketing (though I don’t think the name really conveys that, but that is why their marketing arm gets the big bucks).
When the switch is set to on/off mode, all dimming/ramping is disabled by all methods. The load terminal can only be 0%(off) or 100%(on).
You could closely emulate this with the previous Red series as you noted. However, you had to change several parameters and still had the Minimum Level of 98 which you could dim to and not be 100%.
Great.Anything that makes it easier to use and draws in more buyers makes me happy. Can you tell me what else is new, besides the 800 chip, of course? And, BTW, do we need an 800 hub to get the advantage of an 800 switch or will it get the longer range with a 700 hub? (Which I’m asking as I have a Hubitat C-7). I have several fan + lights that are supposed to 700 series chips but no not connect directly to the hub for some reason (this happens even if the hub is in the same room as the fan+light and in line of sight). I’m wondering/hoping there may be some new software and a more powerful antenna in the switch that helps it connect directly to the hub.
I’ve also noticed that it is often difficult to get a smooth dimming action on the 700s, this is especially true if they are paired as 3-ways. Is there anything in the 2-1 to help with that?
I also heard that the on/off dimming and ramping made each take separate values. Do you know if that will be in there?
Review the first post in this thread. Otherwise, I’ll defer to one of the Eric’s to describe what else is new.
If you’re referring to separate dim rates for up/down/local/remote and separate ramp rates or on/off/local/remote, then the answer is YES they will be in there
Separating up and down ramp and dim rates will be great. I am in the group that would like an instant on, but a gradual dim off for some rooms. Since I’m guessing that is a software thing, do you know if there is any possibility they would be able to implement that into the Red dimmers?
If you are referring to the LZW 500-series z-wave, then I would say it is highly unlikely. But again, one of the Erics would have to give the official answer on that. As previously mentioned, the VZW 800 series z-wave is a dimmer that will have these features (as well as the VZM Blue Zigbee). The goal is to have the VZM and VZW have virtually identical features with the former being Zigbee and the latter being Zwave.
Hope current timeline holds. But I have a sneaking suspicion that the UL certification is expected in 2023, not 2022 as it says. Might want to adjust the post.
Been following this project Phoenix since it started, but I guess now would be a good time to ask whether it’ll support electrical ranges outside of the Americas, notably 220-240V/50Hz which most of the rest of the world uses.
I completely skimmed the part where most of the hardware would be the same as the blue switches which afaik the manufacturer said couldn’t do without tradeoffs/making a separate version.
told me to calm down.
Might want to adjust the post.