Firmware questions

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Alright, everyone, it’s time for me to swallow my pride and acknowledge I know absolutely nothing about upgrading firmware. I have a few dozen Inovelli switches and at issue are some Blue series where I am getting flickering at less than full power. I see discussion here about updating to 2.15 maybe solving the issue. But I use SmartThings. So here are my questions (as dumb as they may be):
(1) is firmware different than the Edge Driver?
(2) assuming yes, it sounds like there isn’t a way to update firmware on the blue series through ST, is that right?
(3) Or is it just that I can’t update OTA and would need to buy a specific device and physically plug something into the switch to update?

Sorry for my novice questions, I have ZERO technical expertise and am just a hobbyist in the smart home arena. Please be gentle in your responses, lol

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We’ve all been there :slight_smile:

  1. Firmware is different than the Edge Driver. The firmware is flashed onto the switch, whereas the Edge Driver (or device handler, converter, quirk, etc depending on the system) handles exposing those firmware parameters in your hub of choice. They go hand in hand, but they are separate pieces with different purposes.

  2. (and 3) Unfortunately that’s correct to my understanding. I believe it’s also the case for the Reds and any kind of firmware updates if you use ST would have to be handled by either another hub or software essentially functioning in the same role.

So, how do you upgrade your switches if you have ST? (going to tag @Bry here because I’m 99% sure he’s still rocking it and I think @Eric_Inovelli uses it as well and either may have other suggestions)

Any chance you have a different hub you’ve used in the past that may support OTA updates? Realize this is a longshot but I’ve learned not to make assumptions.

Do you have a laptop or computer available you can use? You could get a USB dongle and then run Zigbee2MQTT or HomeAssistant with ZHA to handle the upgrades and then rejoin the switches to ST? (if you’re interested in this path, make sure the dongle is compatible with the solution, I can clarify)

How happy are you with ST otherwise? The last option I can think of would just be looking to migrate fully to another hub that supports updates and I can give a general overview at least between Hubitat and Home Assistant and my experiences with either.

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@chack is correct. SmartThings is my primary hub. Eric has one running as well.

Unfortunately, there is no way to upgrade ZIGBEE firmware on SmartThings. I also have Hubitat and HA hubs running, principally for non-production use. If I need to flash Zigbee firmware, then I’ll temporarily add the device to Hubitat to flash it.

Outside of beta testing, I always evaluate whether or not I need the latest firmware. Sometimes a device will work just fine for your purposes without having the latest and greatest. But sometimes, as @kevin.espinosa pointed out, issues (like flickering, for example) develop, which requires a firmware upgrade.

For Zwave, I use SILabs PC Controller. I remove my devices from ST and flash them using the PC Controller in the standalone configuration. I do not add it as a secondary controller.

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Thank you @chack and @Bry for your incredibly helpful responses. A few responses. I do NOT have another hub available but I DO have a laptop available. I’m not wed to ST, but for someone like me with no technical/coding experience I’ve always heard it’s the easiest to use. I’m open to HA/Hubitat either as a complete replacement or as just a separate hub to use for updates as @Bry does. Are they too complicated for a non-tech/coder to use?

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Here are my thoughts. I think you have to evaluate if ST is currently doing everything that you need it to, with the exception of upgrading firmware. If it does, then there probably isn’t a need to switch, and I would explore one of the other hubs just to flash firmware, bearing in mind how often you’ll need to do that vs the time investment to reach that goal. I’d also look at alternatives to any firmware related issues, such as different bulbs if you’re having a flashing issue.

On the other hand, if you are not happy with ST or you just want to experiment with another hub, then I’d look at adding another hub. You don’t have to commit to switching over to that other hub. Add it, add a few devices, flash firmware, etc and see what you think. You can have multiple branded hubs in your ecosystem and have them interoperate. SharpTools Rule Engine, as an example, will allow you to run rules over ST, Hubitat, HA and Homey. So you can, for example, trigger an event with a device on one brand hub and have the actions trigger on another.

You are correct that ST is the easiest to use. For the most part, it just works. As with all hubs, of course, there will be glitches. I’d rank Hubitat second in terms of ease of use. HA will be the most difficult. It’s the most powerful in terms of configurability and in terms of devices that it will support, but if you are maniacal about your home automation system and have a significant amount of time to devote to it, that may be your choice. A HA user will say that it has a “steep learning curve”.

You can buy a Hubitat and it’s ready to set up out of the box. There are a number of approaches on how to run HA. It will run on a Raspberry PI, in a Docker container, on a HA yellow (which is a PI based kit) and probably some other ways I haven’t thought of. You’ll have to make further decisions regarding hardware, such as which Zigbee and Zwave dongles to use.

So you have options. My TLDR is try a Hubitat, not with the intention of converting initially. Try it, see how you like it, use it to flash, and then go from there.

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Hubitat I think has been in that simpler to use spot, but without a lot of change or improvement. The only caution I have with them in terms of updates is that they don’t allow for local Zigbee firmware updates and instead require files uploaded to their own cloud (not the case for Zwave, you can use local files for that). Otherwise, it works fine but it left me wanting more.

Home Assistant has taken massive strides to be more accessible, and while they’re definitely a lot better than they were, I think there’s still a decent learning curve required especially if you aren’t technical at all. The upsides are that they have monthly updates and excellent integrations, but it’s not always the friendliest.

All that said…if you’re happy with ST, there’s really no reason to do a wholesale change and depending on how many devices you have, that ends up being a lot of work. I’d agree with @Bry, Hubitat is probably the way to go to update your switches though while letting you evaluate if there’s something more you want.

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What a very timely post/question for me. I would like to upgrade the firmware on my Blue series switches, but I have no pressing need as 2.08 seems to be working just fine for me. I also have several recently added Blue switches running 2.15 w/no issue. I am a very long time ST user with ~250 devices (almost all Zigbee) and I have to say that things are working very well for my setup. After reading this thread and the feedback, along with a couple other threads on a similar topic, I’m going to use a Hubitat hub for firmware updates, and just to experiment with another hub as well. @chack and @Bry thank you for your posts, much appreciated.

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Thank you, again, @Bry and @chack! There are some minor things ST doesn’t do that I’d like but it’s never been in the “must have” category, so I may follow the suggestion of experimenting with Hubitat to see what it can do.

Do I need to use some of the other items you mentioned like a Raspberry PI or is that only if I choose to take things further and try to learn more?

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For the Hubitat, you buy the hub just as you would a ST hub. So you just buy the hub, plug it in and it’s ready to set up.

HA is an open source application. In some cases, you need to build whatever it will run on.
Some use a Raspberry pi for that, although there are alternatives. Or you can buy a HA yellow which is available assembled or as a kit.

So the extra items I mentioned apply in some cases to HA.

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You’ve said enough to seal the deal for Hubitat. I’m not ready/equipped to take that next step to HA (yet). Thank you, again! This is such a helpful community!

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I’ve been running Hubitat for a couple of years now and been very pleased with it. I’m so comfortable with it, that I even installed it at my parent’s house in another state. The remote access helps, but it just goes 99% and I don’t need to worry about it.

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Nice! Be sure to join the Hubitat Community – lots of helpful folks there. Hubitat also has ways of tying into Home Assistant too, so if you someday decide to go that route, Hubitat could be a segue/bridge to that in a similar way you’ll use Hubitat with ST now.

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Used Hubitat C7 hubs are often on eBay now for around $30 US, now that the C8 is out. It would work fine to use as a ZigBee (and zwave) firmware update tool.

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Now that is a great idea, thanks for sharing!

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@Bry @chack Thanks to you both, I took the plunge into Hubitat. I have been up and running with my new hub for about 30 hours now and have moved over just about every single device I have. The flickering light issue for my theater room lights has completely disappeared with firmware 2.15! And some of the automations and notifications I had been wanting to use for a while but weren’t critical work wonderfully on Hubitat!

I have one last (hopefully) firmware question, if you know. In Hubitat some of my Inovelli blues show firmware version 2.08 or 2.00, but when I push the update firmware option for the switch and then check the logs, the logs say that the firmware is up to date. Any ideas on what is going on there?

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@harjms
@mamber

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Yeah, the Device page info can sometimes lag or resist updating info – it will likely correct itself within a day, but if you want to force it, then I think this should work (it’s been a while since I’ve done it)…

Try changing the Device Type (driver) to just plain “Device” (yep, that’s actually what it’s called in the driver listing). With “Device”, there will be options to clear current states etc, and a Get Info option. The Device driver is a handy way to tidy things up, especially when switching drivers.

Use the Get Info option and watch the live logs – it should confirm the current firmware as another warm fuzzy. Then use the clear current states option (or something like that - I don’t have it in front of me ATM), and then switch back to the driver you were using for the Blue.

Your parameters should all remain the same as before, and the correct f/w should now be reflected on the Blue’s Device page.

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@kevin.espinosa @Bry - The way I get it to show up is to Configure All, Refresh All, Reload the page/refresh chrome F5.

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Thank you @hydro311 @harjms! I’ll be patient!

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It takes about 10 secs.

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